The Wacken Open Air decadence

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Brom

Newbie
24 Dez. 2016
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I completely agree with the topic starter. The lineup of 2017 is an absolute disaster.
I was following lineups of WOA for years, and when I was able to finally buy a ticket myself, the lineup just sucks. I guess it's a bad luck, or bad timing, or Wacken just goes deeper and deeper into commercialization.
The fact, that most of visitors of this forum praise the lineup, is not representative at all - because most of them are die hard fans of WOA anyways.
But I was speaking to the bunch of different metalheads about this lineup (some of those people were multiple times on Wacken and are even featured in WOA documentary) - and all of them were just laughing at the lineup and saying that they're happy that they didn't buy a ticket.
And think for yourself - several months ago I heard an advertisement on a radio promoting WOA, then yesterday I saw a poster in the U-Bahn station with Wacken, and today in Markthalle (concert club in Hamburg) I saw flyers that promote tickets to WOA. I haven't seen such advertisements in previous several years. So this really means that the ticket sales are bad. And I'd say partially because of the price and of course partially because of the crappy lineup. And saying that more than 50k tickets were sold in a first day but then 10k tickets couldn't be sold in more than half a year - is an absolute lie, only a fool can believe this bullshit. And this makes me not just disappointed but also angry, because the visitors are treated like a morons who will buy any crap they are offered.
So if WOA management publicly tries to pretend that everything is fine, you can still feel that that things a going down the hill.
 

Quark

Der Beste
19 Juli 2004
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Your statement sucks.
And for various reasons!
Number 1: "So if WOA management publicly tries to pretend that everything is fine, you can still feel that that things a going down the hill." That's easy, you deny any answer given by the organisation as bad, regardless of the answer. If you want some kind of discussion, you should be prepared for any answer, and not by definition draw a conclusion, based on the given answer. You are just doing it right now!
Number 2: taste is so subjective! You may or may not like this year's line up, and that's fine with me! But saying it's crap as a given fact, is crap!
Number 3: if you claim something, check it!
10,000 tickets were sold out in a relatively short time! But no one ever gave you any number of remaining tickets! So...where's your 10,000 coming from?


And where in f*ck's name is written that you have to go? If you don't like it, there's a Flohmarkt and a Flea Market. Apparently your German is well enough.

Groeten uit het buitenland.
 

Brom

Newbie
24 Dez. 2016
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Hamburg
Number 1: "So if WOA management publicly tries to pretend that everything is fine, you can still feel that that things a going down the hill." That's easy, you deny any answer given by the organisation as bad, regardless of the answer. If you want some kind of discussion, you should be prepared for any answer, and not by definition draw a conclusion, based on the given answer. You are just doing it right now!
If you haven't noticed, I wasn't even asking any questions. I just gave some facts, and after the facts gave a conclusion. Only time will tell if I'm right.
My main goal is to bring out of my chest what I think and support the topic starter.

Number 2: taste is so subjective! You may or may not like this year's line up, and that's fine with me! But saying it's crap as a given fact, is crap!
If you haven't noticed, I wrote that I spoke with the bunch of different people (in fact, people from different countries that have different tastes) and all of them said that lineup is crap.
If one person doesn't like something, it might be a unique case, but if a lot of people (from potential target group of the festival) share the same feeling - than it's a statistically significant tendency.

Number 3: if you claim something, check it!
10,000 tickets were sold out in a relatively short time! But no one ever gave you any number of remaining tickets! So...where's your 10,000 coming from?
How about practicing what you preach?
1_facepalm.gif
You claim that "no one ever gave any number of remaining tickets", but you didn't check it.
So here you go, the official WOA news.

UNBELIEVABLE: 45.000 REGULAR TICKETS SOLD!!! (in some reason, link doesn't work, so here it is - http://www.wacken.com/en/news/news/news-detail/unbelievable-45000-regular-tickets-sold/)

Yag8zh6.jpg


THE LAST 10.000 W:O:A 2017 TICKETS ARE ON SALE!

A5MFE3F.jpg


And you can see the date - 8th of August 2016 (and the ticket sale started this day too). Now it's april 2017, and the remaining 10k tickets still aren't sold.
Do you believe that you can sell 85% of stuff in 1 day and then not sell remaining 15% in more than half a year? As a person who's working in e-commerce I can tell you that it's practically not possible.
 

Hirnschlacht

Moderator
14 Mai 2007
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If you haven't noticed, I wrote that I spoke with the bunch of different people (in fact, people from different countries that have different tastes) and all of them said that lineup is crap.
If one person doesn't like something, it might be a unique case, but if a lot of people (from potential target group of the festival) share the same feeling - than it's a statistically significant tendency.

But "a lot" of people is not an appropriate term for a statistic enquiry. The only thing, we can say for sure is, that the tastes are different. Many people like the line up, many people don´t like it.

In my personal opinion it is the best festival line up this year. Not because I´m a die hard fan like you said, but because it simply includes the most Bands that I want to see. And I can asure you, that the people in this forum are definitly not just stupid die hard fans that like Wacken, just because it´s Wacken! If they think the line up sucks, they would simply say so and visit another festival.

And you can see the date - 8th of August 2016 (and the ticket sale started this day too). Now it's april 2017, and the remaining 10k tickets still aren't sold.
Do you believe that you can sell 85% of stuff in 1 day and then not sell remaining 15% in more than half a year? As a person who's working in e-commerce I can tell you that it's practically not possible.

Why this can´t be possible? The present situation of the european mayor festival ticket sales is completly uniqe. There where never so many festivals with this size, an era of big metal bands that will quit, some huge changes in the music buisness in general and so on. And the WOA situation itself is special too. There were a few years with sold outs and also a lot of black market tickets. A big price increasement and bad weather for the last years. I think there are at least so many variables, that nearly everything is possible!
 

SAVA

W:O:A Metalgod
4 Aug. 2014
63.165
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I completely agree with the topic starter. The lineup of 2017 is an absolute disaster.
I was following lineups of WOA for years, and when I was able to finally buy a ticket myself, the lineup just sucks. I guess it's a bad luck, or bad timing, or Wacken just goes deeper and deeper into commercialization.
The fact, that most of visitors of this forum praise the lineup, is not representative at all - because most of them are die hard fans of WOA anyways.
But I was speaking to the bunch of different metalheads about this lineup (some of those people were multiple times on Wacken and are even featured in WOA documentary) - and all of them were just laughing at the lineup and saying that they're happy that they didn't buy a ticket.
And think for yourself - several months ago I heard an advertisement on a radio promoting WOA, then yesterday I saw a poster in the U-Bahn station with Wacken, and today in Markthalle (concert club in Hamburg) I saw flyers that promote tickets to WOA. I haven't seen such advertisements in previous several years. So this really means that the ticket sales are bad. And I'd say partially because of the price and of course partially because of the crappy lineup. And saying that more than 50k tickets were sold in a first day but then 10k tickets couldn't be sold in more than half a year - is an absolute lie, only a fool can believe this bullshit. And this makes me not just disappointed but also angry, because the visitors are treated like a morons who will buy any crap they are offered.
So if WOA management publicly tries to pretend that everything is fine, you can still feel that that things a going down the hill.
You think the Line-up is crap? I think you don't like Metal Music!:mad:
You saw advertisemets for the festival? Sure because they want to sell tickets because it is not sold out yet...:rolleyes:
 

Revalon

W:O:A Metalmaster
27 Apr. 2007
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You think the Line-up is crap? I think you don't like Metal Music!:mad:
You saw advertisemets for the festival? Sure because they want to sell tickets because it is not sold out yet...:rolleyes:

But there never was advertisement in the years before (of course that has nothing to do with advertising a sold out event not making any sense). Total commerce now.
And there regularly were big headliners since 2008. This year there is no such big headliner. Total commerce now.
 

Sorrownator

W:O:A Metalhead
9 Aug. 2010
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I guess it's a bad luck, or bad timing, or Wacken just goes deeper and deeper into commercialization.
So, you want a big headliner (commercial sucessfull?) but you blame the Wacken-Team to be too much into "commercialization"? To be honest: I'm not quite sure were you want to go :confused: Especially with Volbeat - one of the most sucessfull bands in the last years, as a headliner.
 

Revalon

W:O:A Metalmaster
27 Apr. 2007
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So, you want a big headliner (commercial sucessfull?) but you blame the Wacken-Team to be too much into "commercialization"? To be honest: I'm not quite sure were you want to go :confused: Especially with Volbeat - one of the most sucessfull bands in the last years, as a headliner.

But it's not the successful band that he wants to see. Therefor, he's absolutely right to complain. How dare they not asking hin which bands to book for the festival?
How can you not understand that?
 
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Brom

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24 Dez. 2016
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C'mon, Megadeth was playing in Docks (club fits ~2k people) last year and Accept was supporting Sabaton on their recent tour - this is really not enough to headline a huge festival.
The big headliners would be something like AC/DC, Kiss, Manowar, Aerosmith, even Slipknot (hated and loved as Volbeat), or maybe pulling out some surprise like Van Halen, ZZ TOP, Guns N' Roses - can you imagine any of them supporting today Sabaton or playing in a 2k people club?

You can make your "funny" jokes as much as you wish and pretend about hard festival conditions, but there is a fact: Hellfest with the similar price tag was sold out in a matter of days!

If 50-60k tickets for WOA were sold on 8th of August, than why remaining 10k tickets weren't sold next day, or at least in a several days? Oh, the festival situation in Europe changed just in one day, or a historical weather conditions changed, or some special campaign ended? Give me a break! There were no significant changes between 8th and 9th of August that could drastically reduce the trend of purchases. Every sane person who was studying at least a bit of economics and math statistics will tell you that trend will not make such an insane drop without any considerable factors. Don't be a fools. Obviously, they just lied about remaining 10k on a first day, because they were trying to trick customers into buying as many tickets as possible.

Wacken management just wanted to score a big profit margin by intentionally booking weak headliners in connection with raising prices and rushing all the people to buy the tickets. Well, we see how it all worked out...
 

Hirnschlacht

Moderator
14 Mai 2007
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C'mon, Megadeth was playing in Docks (club fits ~2k people) last year and Accept was supporting Sabaton on their recent tour - this is really not enough to headline a huge festival.
The big headliners would be something like AC/DC, Kiss, Manowar, Aerosmith, even Slipknot (hated and loved as Volbeat), or maybe pulling out some surprise like Van Halen, ZZ TOP, Guns N' Roses - can you imagine any of them supporting today Sabaton or playing in a 2k people club?

Alice Cooper, Marylin Manson, Status Quo, Volbeat, Avantasia? At least it´s down to your personal taste. Nothing else.

You can make your "funny" jokes as much as you wish and pretend about hard festival conditions, but there is a fact: Hellfest with the similar price tag was sold out in a matter of days!

Wacken was sold out in a matter of Hours in the last few years. Let´s have a look, what´s with the Hellfest in a few years. When all the AC/DCs, Guns N Roses, Aerosmiths and Kiss´s in retirement...

If 50-60k tickets for WOA were sold on 8th of August, than why remaining 10k tickets weren't sold next day, or at least in a several days? Oh, the festival situation in Europe changed just in one day, or a historical weather conditions changed, or some special campaign ended? Give me a break! There were no significant changes between 8th and 9th of August that could drastically reduce the trend of purchases. Every sane person who was studying at least a bit of economics and math statistics will tell you that trend will not make such an insane drop without any considerable factors. Don't be a fools. Obviously, they just lied about remaining 10k on a first day, because they were trying to trick customers into buying as many tickets as possible.

Wacken management just wanted to score a big profit margin by intentionally booking weak headliners in connection with raising prices and rushing all the people to buy the tickets. Well, we see how it all worked out...

Don´t try to be a smartass. I didn´t talk about a day´s change, it was an progress over years. The last few years, the tickets we´re all sold out in a few hours. In these few years the Hellfest gets more and more attention. Wacken therefore has to deal with two years of bad weather, and also a price increasement. Because of that and many other reasons, the run on the tickets doesn´t come to an end. There are more people who will wait until all the line ups finished, and stuff. The years before there were just more instant buyer. This is a logical process. More offerings for a limited clientbase.

Otherwise I hope you got some proof for your accusations...
 

Blake

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5 Aug. 2014
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C'mon, Megadeth was playing in Docks (club fits ~2k people) last year and Accept was supporting Sabaton on their recent tour - this is really not enough to headline a huge festival.
The big headliners would be something like AC/DC, Kiss, Manowar, Aerosmith, even Slipknot (hated and loved as Volbeat), or maybe pulling out some surprise like Van Halen, ZZ TOP, Guns N' Roses - can you imagine any of them supporting today Sabaton or playing in a 2k people club?

You can make your "funny" jokes as much as you wish and pretend about hard festival conditions, but there is a fact: Hellfest with the similar price tag was sold out in a matter of days!

If 50-60k tickets for WOA were sold on 8th of August, than why remaining 10k tickets weren't sold next day, or at least in a several days? Oh, the festival situation in Europe changed just in one day, or a historical weather conditions changed, or some special campaign ended? Give me a break! There were no significant changes between 8th and 9th of August that could drastically reduce the trend of purchases. Every sane person who was studying at least a bit of economics and math statistics will tell you that trend will not make such an insane drop without any considerable factors. Don't be a fools. Obviously, they just lied about remaining 10k on a first day, because they were trying to trick customers into buying as many tickets as possible.

Wacken management just wanted to score a big profit margin by intentionally booking weak headliners in connection with raising prices and rushing all the people to buy the tickets. Well, we see how it all worked out...
Lets see. What big bands are playing at Wacken, Graspop and Hellfest
Wacken has Volbeat, one of the biggest metal bands in Europe
Hellfest (H) has Aerosmith a big Hard Rock Band, but I don't know if this band is a good "headliner" for a metal festival
Graspop (G) has Rammstein. They've been their in Wacken 2013 and they are playing at Rock am Ring
Deep Purple (H, G): 2013 in Wacken before Rammstein. Thats a good band, but I would like Wacken to spend a lot of money for a hardrock band that has played here a few years ago (same with Scorpions (G)), they booked Status Quo and Alice Cooper instead.
Linkin Park:Puke: (H): thats not even hardrock anymore
Evanescence(G): Thats not a big band anymore.
Rob Zombie (H, G): 2015? in Wacken
Slayer (H): Thats a band I would love to see in Wacken,
FFDP(H), Prophets of Rage (G, H): I don't care about these bands
Trust: never heard of it o_O
Emperor: Wacken 2017
In Flames: Wacken 2014?

Wacken has: Megadeth, Accept (I don't care if they were supporting Sabaton, because they are playing a huge show and Sabaton isn't a special Band anymore, since they are touring all the time), Marylon Manson, Amon Amarth, Avantasia, Morbid Angel

In my opinion, Hellfest and Graspop don't have the better Line Up. But I don't need a big band to have fun at a festival. I need friends to party, good! (not big!) bands and a little comfort like free Water, clean toilets and I like to camp next my car.
If you want to go Hellfest or Graspop then go and buy a ticket. But I know a lot people who were at all three festivals think, that you can't compare those festivals, because they are all very different and it just depends on what you like and do at a festival.
 
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Quark

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And I went to all of the big 3 (er, 4, if you count Dynamo Open Air with it as well)
All 4 in 4 diferent countries, with all that comes with it.
And tbh, I do think that plays a role as well.
Netherlands and Germany (NL, D) have a relatively easy policy concerning parking next to your tent, whereas France (F) and Belgium(B) do have a strickt policy of separating cars with tents. (camper exceptions in B) As a consequence, the latter are more focussed on the festival area, where NL and D also create a possibility to party at the camping.
Exceptions comfirm the rule. The Dong festival (D) is in a natural environment, therefore no cars allowed.
 

Bärtel

W:O:A Metalmaster
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But I was speaking to the bunch of different metalheads about this lineup (some of those people were multiple times on Wacken and are even featured in WOA documentary) - and all of them were just laughing at the lineup and saying that they're happy that they didn't buy a ticket.
Maybe you should try and listen to some of the bands. Lineups in general are way better if you know some of the bands. There are Spotify/Youtube-Playlists or this helpful thread.